Comments on: dd-details wrong again http://html5doctor.com/dd-details-wrong-again/ helping you implement HTML5 today Tue, 07 Feb 2012 11:44:17 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v= By: Alohci http://html5doctor.com/dd-details-wrong-again/#comment-2160 Alohci Mon, 01 Feb 2010 01:13:36 +0000 http://html5doctor.com/?p=991#comment-2160 Since 30th January, the heading element for figure is now "figcaption", replacing DT. DD is simply dropped from figure. The body of figure is everything inside the figure element except for figcaption and its contents. Details is changed similarly, with the heading element for details becoming "summary". Since 30th January, the heading element for figure is now “figcaption”, replacing DT. DD is simply dropped from figure. The body of figure is everything inside the figure element except for figcaption and its contents.

Details is changed similarly, with the heading element for details becoming “summary”.

]]> By: Blijbol http://html5doctor.com/dd-details-wrong-again/#comment-1721 Blijbol Thu, 26 Nov 2009 22:38:59 +0000 http://html5doctor.com/?p=991#comment-1721 <strong>Appearantly, there's a very simple solution to this problem.</strong> Yes, much simpler than the solutions presented here. Read about it on my blog: http://blog.jeroenvandergun.nl/7-html5-figure-and-details-do-not-break-in-ie Appearantly, there’s a very simple solution to this problem. Yes, much simpler than the solutions presented here.

Read about it on my blog:
http://blog.jeroenvandergun.nl/7-html5-figure-and-details-do-not-break-in-ie

]]> By: Blijbol http://html5doctor.com/dd-details-wrong-again/#comment-1720 Blijbol Thu, 26 Nov 2009 20:37:19 +0000 http://html5doctor.com/?p=991#comment-1720 I think the problem is smaller than it seems. Why do you want to style the dd element? The only logical reason is probably to remove the margin on the left. It isn't a huge problem if this style is bled to the parent since the parent probably doesn't have a margin anyway. For all other cases, you can either insert a span element inside the dd element and style the span, or put the figure or details element inside a div and style that div. I think the problem is smaller than it seems. Why do you want to style the dd element? The only logical reason is probably to remove the margin on the left. It isn’t a huge problem if this style is bled to the parent since the parent probably doesn’t have a margin anyway.

For all other cases, you can either insert a span element inside the dd element and style the span, or put the figure or details element inside a div and style that div.

]]> By: Lars Gunther http://html5doctor.com/dd-details-wrong-again/#comment-1406 Lars Gunther Fri, 16 Oct 2009 15:43:28 +0000 http://html5doctor.com/?p=991#comment-1406 I am just about ready to give up on this. I have been arguing that dt/dd is bad since it changes the semantics as well as the syntax from its usage in dl, which is really bad from a teaching POV. To deaf ears. Dean Edwards et al have been arguing that the solution is bad from a technical POV. To deaf ears. I really, really wish that something that actually was untested and thrown out like an "hey, this is an interesting idea" would not be carved into stone as it apparently has. I am just about ready to give up on this. I have been arguing that dt/dd is bad since it changes the semantics as well as the syntax from its usage in dl, which is really bad from a teaching POV. To deaf ears. Dean Edwards et al have been arguing that the solution is bad from a technical POV. To deaf ears.

I really, really wish that something that actually was untested and thrown out like an “hey, this is an interesting idea” would not be carved into stone as it apparently has.

]]> By: Tino Zijdel http://html5doctor.com/dd-details-wrong-again/#comment-1402 Tino Zijdel Fri, 16 Oct 2009 08:09:18 +0000 http://html5doctor.com/?p=991#comment-1402 Just a thought: Microsoft is still supporting IE6 and IE7 and actively patching (security) issues in those browsers. Wouldn't it be possible to ask Microsoft to patch this particular issue in IE6 and IE7 and distribute that patch the same as other patches for IE6 and 7? Chances are that people who will still be using IE6/7 some years from now will at least use a patched version, so imo it's not too late to solve this problem at the source. Just a thought: Microsoft is still supporting IE6 and IE7 and actively patching (security) issues in those browsers. Wouldn’t it be possible to ask Microsoft to patch this particular issue in IE6 and IE7 and distribute that patch the same as other patches for IE6 and 7? Chances are that people who will still be using IE6/7 some years from now will at least use a patched version, so imo it’s not too late to solve this problem at the source.

]]> By: SelenIT http://html5doctor.com/dd-details-wrong-again/#comment-1377 SelenIT Wed, 14 Oct 2009 17:23:51 +0000 http://html5doctor.com/?p=991#comment-1377 <blockquote>Ironically the problem isn’t with the <code>dt</code> part of the solution, it’s actually with the <code>dd</code>.</blockquote> The problem is with the <em>last</em> part of it, whatever it is. Just swapping <code>dt</code> and <code>dd</code> in the example seems to fix the problem with <code>dd</code> styling... until we try to style dd as well. This is the common problem of old IEs (7 and before) — they <em>completely ignore</em> the closing tags for all sort of list items (<code>li</code>, <code>dt</code> or <code>dd</code>), closing them only implicitly, when the opening tag of the next list item or the closing tag of the list itself appears. I guess that it was done to ensure that the lists contain only allowed elements as direct children (for making the tag soup parsing easier). And IMHO this is the reason not to reuse any list-related tags in any context other than lists...

Ironically the problem isn’t with the dt part of the solution, it’s actually with the dd.

The problem is with the last part of it, whatever it is. Just swapping dt and dd in the example seems to fix the problem with dd styling… until we try to style dd as well.

This is the common problem of old IEs (7 and before) — they completely ignore the closing tags for all sort of list items (li, dt or dd), closing them only implicitly, when the opening tag of the next list item or the closing tag of the list itself appears. I guess that it was done to ensure that the lists contain only allowed elements as direct children (for making the tag soup parsing easier).

And IMHO this is the reason not to reuse any list-related tags in any context other than lists…

]]> By: Chris Pratt http://html5doctor.com/dd-details-wrong-again/#comment-1369 Chris Pratt Wed, 14 Oct 2009 01:59:43 +0000 http://html5doctor.com/?p=991#comment-1369 Couldn't <figure> and <details> be treated just like <section> and simply indent and continue the document outline with <h1>-<h6>? Think of it as just another <section> but with additional semantics. Couldn’t <figure> and <details> be treated just like <section> and simply indent and continue the document outline with <h1>-<h6>? Think of it as just another <section> but with additional semantics.

]]> By: Lisa Firke http://html5doctor.com/dd-details-wrong-again/#comment-1365 Lisa Firke Tue, 13 Oct 2009 18:25:12 +0000 http://html5doctor.com/?p=991#comment-1365 Okay, let's not use dt/dd. The hack is very, very ugly. And the reality is, we have to make some allowance for IE6 and 7. We do. We don't like it, but we do. Can anyone tell me what would be so heinously wrong with just marking up a the content of <em>detail</em> and <em>figure</em> with an h5 or h6 (indicating suitable subordination to the doc as a whole) and a paragraph? Must every title-like thingie and accompanying content have a special contextual tag, or can we just be simpler about things? Or is that just CRAZY talk? ; ) Okay, let’s not use dt/dd. The hack is very, very ugly. And the reality is, we have to make some allowance for IE6 and 7. We do. We don’t like it, but we do.

Can anyone tell me what would be so heinously wrong with just marking up a the content of detail and figure with an h5 or h6 (indicating suitable subordination to the doc as a whole) and a paragraph? Must every title-like thingie and accompanying content have a special contextual tag, or can we just be simpler about things?

Or is that just CRAZY talk? ; )

]]> By: Remy Sharp http://html5doctor.com/dd-details-wrong-again/#comment-1362 Remy Sharp Tue, 13 Oct 2009 16:09:40 +0000 http://html5doctor.com/?p=991#comment-1362 @Alejandro - thats pretty much what I was arguing in the IRC channel here: http://krijnhoetmer.nl/irc-logs/whatwg/20091013#l-554 However I understand the problem with this - and I'll be posting a follow up blog post here shortly explaining how to style up figure and details and how to treat it. @Alejandro – thats pretty much what I was arguing in the IRC channel here: http://krijnhoetmer.nl/irc-logs/whatwg/20091013#l-554

However I understand the problem with this – and I’ll be posting a follow up blog post here shortly explaining how to style up figure and details and how to treat it.

]]> By: Alejandro Moreno http://html5doctor.com/dd-details-wrong-again/#comment-1361 Alejandro Moreno Tue, 13 Oct 2009 16:07:49 +0000 http://html5doctor.com/?p=991#comment-1361 So what's wrong with this? <code> <figure> <header>This is the figure's header.</header> <p>This is the content.</p> <footer>This is the figure's footer.</footer> </figure> </code> And only one of <header> and <footer> are required. So what’s wrong with this?


<figure>
<header>This is the figure's header.</header>
<p>This is the content.</p>
<footer>This is the figure's footer.</footer>
</figure>

And only one of <header> and <footer> are required.

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